Nutritional Plan + questions about supps - Ausbb

theodawg · 24-07-2010, 12:04 AM

Hey,

I'm a new user and joined once I finished reading a posted by Shrek (Favourite place to purchase supplements). Since then i have been reading several threads and have seen the knowledge of many users in particular Fadi. Also the quality & quantity of knowledge is amazing in comparison to other BB websites.

So... i have just gotten back to Europe and decided to try my best at putting on some muscle.

I will show you a sample of my diet which i look forward to using starting on Monday.

Stats:
Age: 18
Weight: 78kg (lost some kg going around Europe)
Height: 6ft2ish
Type: Hardgainer
Here come the depressing lifting stats (note: before europe)
Squat = 110kg 5reps
Bench = 70kg 8reps as of yesterday 10reps 55kg slightly strenuous
Dead = 110kg 6reps
Row = 55kg 8reps

Training:

I'm trying to go 5 days per week, early-ish in the morning

M - Chest + Abs
T - Shoulders or Back
W - Legs + Bike Session
T - Back or Shoulders
F - Arms + Abs
S - Off - Light Cardio session
S - Off

Meal Plan:

Breakfast:
3 Whole Eggs
1 Banana
2 Slices of Bread
1 WPC Protein Shake w/ Full cream milk

PreWO:
USPLabs Jack3d

PWO:
[WPI + WPC + Dextrose + Creatine + Glutamine] Protein Shake W/ Milk

Lunch:
Tues Thurs Fri - Subway Club Footlong
Apple

Arvo Tea:
2 Cans of Tuna
2 Slices of Bread
Cup of Rice or Pasta

Dinner:
Varies -> depends what mum cooks

Before Bed:
Cottage Cheese

Note: Drinking 1L of Soy Milk per day and 2.5+L of Water. 2L of gatorade?

Approximate Calories = 3,239
Approximate Fats = 81.4
Approximate Carbs = 382.4
Approximate Proteins = 248.4
*** Not including dinner ***

Supplements:
Bulknutrients - 1kg of WPI Protein Powder
Bulknutrients - 5kg of WPC Protein Powder
Body Science - 125g of BCAAs
USPLabs - .25kg of Jack3d
1kg of Dextrose
500g of Glutamine
500g Creatine Monohydrate
Multivitamin
Fish Oil

What do you think? I don't want to put much fat on. I'm trying to do a clean bulk up.
Also...
Should i substitute dextrose with Waxy Maize Starch?
Should i mix the creatine with my protein shake? or havethe creatine with some dextrose or fruit juice?

Thanks for checking this out.
Cheers

Stephen

gareer · 24-07-2010, 12:12 AM

Thats alot of gatorade brother, tons of sugar in all of that which your trying to limit, even during training. This is my advice that I wish I was told when I was first starting out.

1. Follow a basic three day workout e.g. Fadi's basic workout or PTC's PPP workout. Both have great results by people using them and develop the strong connections needed before moving on to split days.
2. That is a huge ass list of supplements. Do not waste your money on supplements, by good clean food. Plenty of brown rice and good protein sources (food). And then maybe WPC or WPI (depending on you) plus a multi. You honestly dont need any of that other stuff starting out. Your not an elite athlete yet or even an intermediate lifter (I'm guessing).
3. Work Your ass off and stay focused.

But thats just my two cents, more informed people will comment soon.

Gareer

theodawg · 24-07-2010, 01:06 AM

Cheers for the quick feedback

I know supplements are not everything. That's why for first time im trying to focus on a 'proper' diet. Last time i tried 5day split and saw slight results and i blamed my lack of proper nutrition ranging from eating 1000cals a day to 4000cals.

I tried the Rippetoes Starting Strength but i did not feel it, therefore, did not like it. However, i was probably too quick too dismiss the workout (tried for only 4 weeks - some mass gains but it appeared to be fat).

And after doing some (emphasis on the some) research on diet and supps as well as viewing the supplements some people use over various forums. i could see that whey protein was consistent as well as, multivitamin and creatine were common among the supplement list.

In your opinion... cut the gatorade out altogether during training or just reduce the amount of gatorade?

Cheers

Stephen

EDIT: I bypassed the Fadi Workout and PTC Workout... Quickly jumping to conclusions. I am incredibly interested to try Fadi's workout.

Fadi · 24-07-2010, 01:50 AM

Hello there Stephen and welcome to Ausbb. You sound to me like an intelligent young man who is wiling to listen and that is a great start Champ.

Now young Garrer offered you some really sound advice I believe and he like you is a humble young man. I'm emphasising this point because there are so many young people who confuse their high level of testosterone with having experience.

Now it would really be wise to cut back on two things:

1. Training frequency

2. Unnecessary supplements

You may like to take a look at my

Fadi's 13500 calorie "diet" and see the amount of food I was taking in at the time. Now this has taught me two things which you may find beneficial in avoiding.

1. I was eating in such a way because like you, I had a super fast metabolism.

2. I did not put on any weight even when eating such a huge amount of calories.

Now to the why and to the take home message Stephen...

1. Too much training (8x/week) plus other activities outside of training

2. By cutting down on training, you'll decrease the speed of your metabolism, which would allow the effort you're putting into your caloric intake to take effect.

Now do the above make sense to you?

Possible solutions to help you gain some weight:

1. Total body workout similar to this: Beginners; Look Here!

2. Save your money: Beginners and Novices: Save your $$$

3. Or take a look at this: Building the ultimate muscle machine: move your body through space. Program #1.

Fadi.

gareer · 24-07-2010, 02:18 AM

Steve, following Fadi's advice will take you a long way. And can I add, how do you know your a hardgainer? Take a look at how many cals ur having. In my opinion thats a huge amount for someone starting out. That may be why your seeing mostly fat gains. Work out your base metabolism and go from there. I think somewhere Fadi posted a rough guideline for gaining weight? I'm not 100% sure where it is but maybe 18 calories per pound of BW or 40 per kg. And go from there, ideally you want to be just above your maintenance caloric intake around 500 or so?

The idea being, anything much greater than that and your going to see alot of fat gains, all those extra calories aren't going to help muscle growth. And personally I'd steer clear of gatorade all together. I drink milk, water and coffee...thats it. Occasionally I'll have a sugar free red bull but otherwise I'm fine. All that sugar isn't going to help because of the insulin spike etc (fadi has once again explained this in more detail). Have a piece of fruit before you go for energy if you need it. This is more beneficial than gatorade (i.e fibre, vitamins, minerals etc).

Have a read around and learn as much as you can, good luck!

P.S sorry for the huge blocks of text.

theodawg · 24-07-2010, 01:43 PM

Hey,

Thanks for the advice and assistance and I thought I should whack up a new plan of eating trying to incorporate more whole products instead of supplements.

Training:
Thanks to Fadi's and Gareer's advice i will start using 'Fadi's Workout'

M - Fadi Workout + Cardio
T -
W -Fadi Workout + Bike Session
T -
F - Fadi Workout
S - Off - Light Cardio session
S - Off

Meal Plan:

Breakfast: (~900cals)
Potato (Sweet or Normal) Omelette
1 Banana
2 Slices of Bread
1 Cup of Full Cream Milk

PWO: (~450cals)
Protein Shake W/ Milk
Serving of Fruit

Lunch: (~600cals)
Tues Thurs Fri - Subway Club 6"
1 Apple
1 serving Vegetables

Arvo Tea: (~350cals)
2 Cans of Tuna
2 Bread
1 cups of vegetables

Dinner: (assume 500cals)
Varies -> depends what mum cooks
Assume Low Fat, Mod Protein & High Carbs

Before Bed: (~250cals)
Cottage Cheese

Note: Drinking 500mL of Soy Milk per day (most after dinner) and 2.5+L of Water

Approximate Calories = 3,200

Any modification I should make?

Cheers again

Stephen

Christian · 24-07-2010, 02:24 PM

Why are you drinking soy milk? It ****s around with thyroid function...

Try rice milk.
Posted via Mobile Device

theodawg · 24-07-2010, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by n00bs

Why are you drinking soy milk? It ****s around with thyroid function...

Try rice milk.
Posted via Mobile Device

thats interesting

i just researched a little about rice milk
it says there are levels of arsenic found in Rice products. Could this have potential negative health benefits over time?
Instead of soy milk just stick to cows milk aka skim or full cream?

cant post links...
foodgovuk multimedia pdfs fsis0209arsenicinrice.pdf

Fadi · 24-07-2010, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theodawg

Instead of soy milk just stick to cows milk aka skim or full cream?

I'll give you a WARNING on fats Stephen; never have low or no fat anything. Fat is there for a reason and until someone can claim to be God on earth, then I'll be sticking as best as I can to the way food was meant to be eaten. Read what the best expert has to say on saturated fats Mary G. Enig, PhD.

Google Search (CSE)

PS: You asked about modifications. If you're training at night then I would be having a lot more than just cottage cheese before bed time!

Fadi.

Christian · 24-07-2010, 11:48 PM

If your sticking to full fat make sure its organic and unhomogonised...

Hormones are fat soluble so we dont want added ones making their way into our bodies unless its t

Posted via Mobile Device

24-07-2010, 12:04 AM	#1 (permalink)
theodawg Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Brisbane Gender: Posts: 148	Nutritional Plan + questions about supps Hey, I'm a new user and joined once I finished reading a posted by Shrek (Favourite place to purchase supplements). Since then i have been reading several threads and have seen the knowledge of many users in particular Fadi. Also the quality & quantity of knowledge is amazing in comparison to other BB websites. So... i have just gotten back to Europe and decided to try my best at putting on some muscle. I will show you a sample of my diet which i look forward to using starting on Monday. Stats: Age: 18 Weight: 78kg (lost some kg going around Europe) Height: 6ft2ish Type: Hardgainer Here come the depressing lifting stats (note: before europe) Squat = 110kg 5reps Bench = 70kg 8reps as of yesterday 10reps 55kg slightly strenuous Dead = 110kg 6reps Row = 55kg 8reps Training: I'm trying to go 5 days per week, early-ish in the morning M - Chest + Abs T - Shoulders or Back W - Legs + Bike Session T - Back or Shoulders F - Arms + Abs S - Off - Light Cardio session S - Off Meal Plan: Breakfast: 3 Whole Eggs 1 Banana 2 Slices of Bread 1 WPC Protein Shake w/ Full cream milk PreWO: USPLabs Jack3d PWO: [WPI + WPC + Dextrose + Creatine + Glutamine] Protein Shake W/ Milk Lunch: Tues Thurs Fri - Subway Club Footlong Apple Arvo Tea: 2 Cans of Tuna 2 Slices of Bread Cup of Rice or Pasta Dinner: Varies -> depends what mum cooks Before Bed: Cottage Cheese Note: Drinking 1L of Soy Milk per day and 2.5+L of Water. 2L of gatorade? Approximate Calories = 3,239 Approximate Fats = 81.4 Approximate Carbs = 382.4 Approximate Proteins = 248.4 * Not including dinner * Supplements: Bulknutrients - 1kg of WPI Protein Powder Bulknutrients - 5kg of WPC Protein Powder Body Science - 125g of BCAAs USPLabs - .25kg of Jack3d 1kg of Dextrose 500g of Glutamine 500g Creatine Monohydrate Multivitamin Fish Oil What do you think? I don't want to put much fat on. I'm trying to do a clean bulk up. Also... Should i substitute dextrose with Waxy Maize Starch? Should i mix the creatine with my protein shake? or havethe creatine with some dextrose or fruit juice? Thanks for checking this out. Cheers Stephen Last edited by theodawg; 28-07-2010 at 12:03 AM.

24-07-2010, 01:06 AM	#3 (permalink)
theodawg Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Brisbane Gender: Posts: 148	Cheers for the quick feedback I know supplements are not everything. That's why for first time im trying to focus on a 'proper' diet. Last time i tried 5day split and saw slight results and i blamed my lack of proper nutrition ranging from eating 1000cals a day to 4000cals. I tried the Rippetoes Starting Strength but i did not feel it, therefore, did not like it. However, i was probably too quick too dismiss the workout (tried for only 4 weeks - some mass gains but it appeared to be fat). And after doing some (emphasis on the some) research on diet and supps as well as viewing the supplements some people use over various forums. i could see that whey protein was consistent as well as, multivitamin and creatine were common among the supplement list. In your opinion... cut the gatorade out altogether during training or just reduce the amount of gatorade? Cheers Stephen EDIT: I bypassed the Fadi Workout and PTC Workout... Quickly jumping to conclusions. I am incredibly interested to try Fadi's workout. Last edited by theodawg; 24-07-2010 at 01:53 AM.

24-07-2010, 01:50 AM	#4 (permalink)
Fadi Super Moderator Ausbb's resident Yoda Join Date: Jul 2009 Gender: Posts: 3,415	Hello there Stephen and welcome to Ausbb. You sound to me like an intelligent young man who is wiling to listen and that is a great start Champ. Now young Garrer offered you some really sound advice I believe and he like you is a humble young man. I'm emphasising this point because there are so many young people who confuse their high level of testosterone with having experience. Now it would really be wise to cut back on two things: 1. Training frequency 2. Unnecessary supplements You may like to take a look at my Fadi's 13500 calorie "diet" and see the amount of food I was taking in at the time. Now this has taught me two things which you may find beneficial in avoiding. 1. I was eating in such a way because like you, I had a super fast metabolism. 2. I did not put on any weight even when eating such a huge amount of calories. Now to the why and to the take home message Stephen... 1. Too much training (8x/week) plus other activities outside of training 2. By cutting down on training, you'll decrease the speed of your metabolism, which would allow the effort you're putting into your caloric intake to take effect. Now do the above make sense to you? Possible solutions to help you gain some weight: 1. Total body workout similar to this: Beginners; Look Here! 2. Save your money: Beginners and Novices: Save your $$$ 3. Or take a look at this: Building the ultimate muscle machine: move your body through space. Program #1. Fadi. __________________ Squat 200kg, FSquat 195kg, C&J 160kg, PC 140kg, MP 90kg.

24-07-2010, 01:43 PM	#6 (permalink)
theodawg Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Brisbane Gender: Posts: 148	Just modding it up thanks to some feedback Hey, Thanks for the advice and assistance and I thought I should whack up a new plan of eating trying to incorporate more whole products instead of supplements. Training: Thanks to Fadi's and Gareer's advice i will start using 'Fadi's Workout' M - Fadi Workout + Cardio T - W -Fadi Workout + Bike Session T - F - Fadi Workout S - Off - Light Cardio session S - Off Meal Plan: Breakfast: (~900cals) Potato (Sweet or Normal) Omelette 1 Banana 2 Slices of Bread 1 Cup of Full Cream Milk PWO: (~450cals) Protein Shake W/ Milk Serving of Fruit Lunch: (~600cals) Tues Thurs Fri - Subway Club 6" 1 Apple 1 serving Vegetables Arvo Tea: (~350cals) 2 Cans of Tuna 2 Bread 1 cups of vegetables Dinner: (assume 500cals) Varies -> depends what mum cooks Assume Low Fat, Mod Protein & High Carbs Before Bed: (~250cals) Cottage Cheese Note: Drinking 500mL of Soy Milk per day (most after dinner) and 2.5+L of Water Approximate Calories = 3,200 Any modification I should make? Cheers again Stephen

24-07-2010, 02:24 PM	#7 (permalink)
Christian Active Member June10MOTM Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Sydney Gender: Posts: 5,826	Why are you drinking soy milk? It ***s around with thyroid function... Try rice milk. Posted via Mobile Device* __________________ S.P.N.H - Strength Power Nutrition Health http://www.facebook.com/spnhsydney *Information I provide does not substitute a proper medical evaluation by a medical professional; nor does it constitute practitioner/patient relationship, or liability, in any way.

24-07-2010, 11:48 PM	#10 (permalink)
Christian Active Member June10MOTM Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Sydney Gender: Posts: 5,826	If your sticking to full fat make sure its organic and unhomogonised... Hormones are fat soluble so we dont want added ones making their way into our bodies unless its t Posted via Mobile Device __________________ S.P.N.H - Strength Power Nutrition Health http://www.facebook.com/spnhsydney *Information I provide does not substitute a proper medical evaluation by a medical professional; nor does it constitute practitioner/patient relationship, or liability, in any way.