Education

[Reide]

So I know my schools rep isn't that great. I am considering furthering my education after I finish cert 4. The original plan was to do a nutrition and Dietetics course but I am considering doing a diploma in fitness.

I know it's early since I don't finish till may. But I really prefer to be organised. Is it worth it?

 

[White_Lie]

It's your decision if it's worth it or not but one thing that made me think twice was that in 3 or 4 years or however long it takes you to get the degree is that you're going to be that old regardless. So you can just be 30 or you can be 30 with a degree. Chances are if you don't do it now you may want to do it later and then it may get put off because life gets in the way.

If it's something that you enjoy doing and can see yourself doing for a long time then there's never a time to stop learning. It may not always be working towards a piece of paper but if you want to better yourself then you should always be learning new things in your field.

 

[Repacked]

A diploma is only a six month course or isn't it? If you want to try and set yourself apart from others in a competitive field like PTing without having years of practical experience then qualifications are a reasonable bet. Most diplomas will give you credit towards degrees or allow you to get RPL. You may need to do more than a diploma or specialise in a specific area.

 

[Kyle Aaron]

Here you are asking people who have never been nor hired a trainer. It's like asking your vegan friends a recipe for steak and kidney pud, futile.

Potential clients don't care about qualifications, since they have no idea what's required. Other trainers desperately care, but trainers don't hire trainers, so you don't worry about that. You just do it for your own education.

What makes you stand out as a trainer is attitude and practical experience. If you can,

• show up on time
• record their workouts
• progress their effort over time, and
• coach a squat (of whatever kind) and a pushup

congratulations, you're in the top 10%. And I'm not kidding.

 

[Jungnaut]

Sounds simple, doesn't it? But I have yet to see a coach that does ALL of the above when I have hired one. Great people, sure, but they would neglect one or two things out of that list eg, record workouts or ensure proper progression (as opposed to 1.R.M attempts followed by AMRAP backoff sets all dey erry dey)

 

[Kyle Aaron]

So you got unlucky. It happens, unfortunately. As I said, these are unusual things, which is what makes the person top 10%. And the first 3 are entirely the trainer/coach's decision, only the 4th requires knowing something. Well, maybe the 3rd a bit, too, but... Anyway, though it makes you top 10%, I would still only consider that a very basic start.

I've trained over 100 people, not one asked me my qualifications before signing up. Just a few asked - much later - in a conversational way, "So what does it take to be a trainer?" kind of thing.

An education is always a good thing. But remember: in exercise science, you do not study exercise. It's all theory. What physics is to engineering, exercise science is to training. It's the principles, not the practic​e.

 

[Repacked]

Potential clients don't care about qualifications?

Lol ok.

 

[White_Lie]

Potential clients don't care about qualifications?

Lol ok.

I reckon they do but the vast majority wouldn't ask. Most would assume they're qualified to be working there or perhaps the information is available in the gym. Most gyms I've trained at, all the PT's have a profile on the wall with their certs, specialties etc

 

[AnneJordan]

Popular trainer in my area. She bodybuilds and runs a bootcamp as well as one on one PT sessions and comp prep..
Extremely popular and she has alot of clients who have great results.

Big drama/goss/rumour after there as the gym was sold and apparently new owners sacked her because she actually doesnt have a PT qualification and as a franchise they wont have her hired.

I havent hired her just done some bootcamp stuff as friends and not asked because I assumed which most people would do.

If its true and she doesn't, I dont see alot of her clients giving a crap since they are acheiving what they want.

So I gotta agree with [MENTION=2335]Kyle Aaron[/MENTION] !!

 

[Repacked]

I wouldn't care for Bootcamp either. Lol.

 

[Jungnaut]

If she compete in bikini forget about this pesty qualificational bizz, I'd hire her 1-on-1 as well lol!

 

[Kyle Aaron]

Potential clients don't care about qualifications?

Lol ok.

As I said, over 100 people trained, nobody asked. Dave Tate - who used to be a PT - explains it.

"When you drop your car off at the Quickie Lube, do you demand to see the mechanic/technician’s credentials, ask him how long he’s been changing oil, or quiz him on his knowledge of the internal combustion engine? Probably not. If you’re like most of us, you just hand your keys to the first guy you see in a dirty blue jumpsuit, assuming he will not pour five pints of oil into your radiator."
​

Nobody who actually hires trainers cares. Lots of people who "if I were to hire a trainer" care desperately, but they never actually do, so we don't worry about them. We're wearing the polo shirt with our name on it, so the person assumes we know what we're doing. "Well the gym hired the guy, so..." Nobody asks to see my certs any more than they would ask a chef, plumber, taxi driver or anything else.

Now, they do care about empathy and social proof. "She has been on the same weightloss journey as me," or "Bob says he was good." But bits of paper? Nope. They also care about demonstrated competence - do you show you know what you're doing? Which some education may help, but unfortunately lots won't.

I assure you that my colleagues with a Diploma of Fitness or a degree in exercise science did not earn more or have more clients than me with my lowly certificates. Usually they did worse. This did disappoint them, most had an air of "I deserve to be somewhere better than this!" which did not help them get and keep clients, believe me.

 

[Repacked]

As I said, over 100 people trained, nobody asked. Dave Tate - who used to be a PT - explains it.

"When you drop your car off at the Quickie Lube, do you demand to see the mechanic/technician’s credentials, ask him how long he’s been changing oil, or quiz him on his knowledge of the internal combustion engine? Probably not. If you’re like most of us, you just hand your keys to the first guy you see in a dirty blue jumpsuit, assuming he will not pour five pints of oil into your radiator."
​

Nobody who actually hires trainers cares. Lots of people who "if I were to hire a trainer" care desperately, but they never actually do, so we don't worry about them. We're wearing the polo shirt with our name on it, so the person assumes we know what we're doing. "Well the gym hired the guy, so..." Nobody asks to see my certs any more than they would ask a chef, plumber, taxi driver or anything else.

Now, they do care about empathy and social proof. "She has been on the same weightloss journey as me," or "Bob says he was good." But bits of paper? Nope. They also care about demonstrated competence - do you show you know what you're doing? Which some education may help, but unfortunately lots won't.

I assure you that my colleagues with a Diploma of Fitness or a degree in exercise science did not earn more or have more clients than me with my lowly certificates. Usually they did worse. This did disappoint them, most had an air of "I deserve to be somewhere better than this!" which did not help them get and keep clients, believe me.

I'm sure very few people ask you when they walk into your gym. If they have half a brain they have already seen what your quals are on your website and decided whether they think you are suitable for their needs or not, and let's face it - you have a pic of you hangin' with Rip so throw your pieces of paper out.

Most of those analogies are pretty poor, would you not make sure a tradie you're using is licensed? How's your insurance?

My opinion of 95% of PTs is that they're great for middle aged men and women who want to lose a few kgs, or people who have never been to the gym or trained before, but most of them have a body of knowledge not exceeding, and in many cases less than someone who has been training and doing their own research for years. Oh you're a PT with a strength and conditioning qualification and have trained heaps of competitors? Cool, how come you weigh 70kg wringing wet? Cool story bro. As the saying goes, don't trust a skinny chef.

I digress, my point is that 95% of PTs are of no use if you have more than moderate experience. There is a small percentage who have the combination of technical knowledge, regardless of how it has been gained, and experience to be training developed lifters, but they are the minority. Advanced bodybuilding, power lifting or olympic lifting are niche areas compared to your everyday PT, who is really a gym rat with a name badge, areas of expertise, .

 

[Kyle Aaron]

I'm sure very few people ask you when they walk into your gym. If they have half a brain they have already seen what your quals are on your website and decided whether they think you are suitable for their needs or not, and let's face it - you have a pic of you hangin' with Rip so throw your pieces of paper out.

For 4 years I worked at the Y, which had none of us on its websites. And virtually nobody in a mainstream gym knows who Rip is. Or Dan John, or Pavel Tstatsouline, or anyone like that. That's shit that (sometimes, but usually not) impresses people who are either trainers (who as I said, rarely hire trainers), or who train on their own.

My opinion of 95% of PTs is that they're great for middle aged men and women who want to lose a few kgs, or people who have never been to the gym or trained before, but most of them have a body of knowledge not exceeding, and in many cases less than someone who has been training and doing their own research for years.

Yes, though you are perhaps overstating the usefulness of most PTs. Now tell us about this maintream gym where most of the people have been training and doing their own research for years. A big box gym, 1,000-5,000 members. At my old place, at any one time we had 20 males who could squat 100kg or more, 12 of them were my clients, 4 I gave some occasional advice to though they were mostly self-coached, and 4 learned to lift somewhere else and I had nothing to do with, they were trainers, former crossfitters or whatever; I don't count me and the other guy using barbells regularly with clients. We had 6 women who could squat 60kg or more - all were my clients. So less than 1% of gym members had achieved what any healthy person under 50 can do in 3-6 months of even half-arsed trying.

Partly that was limitations of time, at $80 or so an hour the typical PT client did 2x30' sessions a week, which just isn't long enough for serious training. But the 4,850 people not doing personal training, at least some of whom would not be pressed for time, only 8 of the guys and none of the women had hit those novice numbers. So whether they had PTs or not, they simply lacked the knowledge that they could and should do this. That, I'm sorry to say, is a mainstream gym.

Remember, that's where most PTs work out - and if you think they're mostly clueless (as I do), just wait till you talk to the gym members. You evidently didn't read Tate's article:

"The next time you catch yourself pontificating to a prospect about the intricacies of moderate vs. wide-stance squatting, try reminding yourself that the odds are very good that this person owns a ShakeWeight."​

Now go read it. He knows more than either you or me by far, and he says not only do qualifications not matter, competence doesn't, either - if you're just talking financial success at a mainstream gym. What matters is personality and hustle.

Obviously if you run your own business, competence will matter a bit more. But it's still not everything. To succeed as a PT, brains or personality - either will do, both will make you very successful.

 

[Headley]

Ehh if i had my time over again id do a diploma in nursing, then go to uni and do the degree.

 

[Repacked]

Now go read it. He knows more than either you or me by far, and he says not only do qualifications not matter, competence doesn't, either - if you're just talking financial success at a mainstream gym. What matters is personality and hustle.

Obviously if you run your own business, competence will matter a bit more. But it's still not everything. To succeed as a PT, brains or personality - either will do, both will make you very successful.

Ok, reasonable article which seems to confirm what I said and you agreed with re. the uselessness of most PTs. So, incompetent but great to chat to and super enthusiastic, all for only $80/hr. Where do I sign up? Maybe I'm just more cynical than most people.

 

[Goosey]

As far as lifting weight is concerned, it's a very simple task.
the only real qualification that should be necessary is for a person to spend time under the bar, to pay their dues.

the other two prerequisites are; being able to communicate, passion and knowing what the trainee requires, that's three.
the other is and most importantly, duty of care.
which is rarely considered.

 

[Goosey]

But this is an industry and I don't know why the fuck for, but again I digress.

 

[AnneJordan]

If she compete in bikini forget about this pesty qualificational bizz, I'd hire her 1-on-1 as well lol!

Figure going physique she's a unit.

 

[Repacked]

As far as lifting weight is concerned, it's a very simple task.
the only real qualification that should be necessary is for a person to spend time under the bar, to pay their dues.

the other two prerequisites are; being able to communicate, passion and knowing what the trainee requires, that's three.
the other is and most importantly, duty of care.
which is rarely considered.

I disagree with this. Yes anyone can squat simply by squatting, but to lift either heavy weights period, or at a high level of intensity (representing heavy weights for the specific lifter) and improve regularly can be a complicated task. How much knowledge has [MENTION=8399]0ni[/MENTION]; had to gain and utilise to get to where he is at?