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Darkoz
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So if you were explaining an exercise to someone how would you describe a bench press compared to a standing press?
They're just descriptive names given to different types of presses, if you're standing and pressing the weight up it makes sense then to call it what it is, a standing/overhead press, same with bench press etc.
The Hamburgler
Spotter Loader
^ exactly
Press could mean anything from strict overhead press, push press, seated press, press up (as they say in Britain), incline press, horizontal/ flat press, decline press etc etc etc
As far as the article goes the first point about muscle activation I didn't pay much attention to however his point about shoulder mobility, impingement etc is scientifically correct, particularly if the hands are pronated (a reason I will likely never do straight bar overhead work again). Joe DeFranco is anti overhead pressing for most athletes unless they have sufficient shoulder and thoracic mobility. Few other S&C guys around that have the same school of thought too
I'm on the fence a bit because I haven't personally seen enough cases to make a judgement but I'm leaning towards 'people with internally rotated (or hunched) shoulders should avoid overhead pressing, particularly with a pronated grip until their posture is improved'
This does raise the argument of whether or not pull ups will cause the same shoulder problems (again, my experiences with a wider grip especially, seem to suggest that shoulder immobility makes all overhead pushing and pulling potentially a dangerous activity)
Press could mean anything from strict overhead press, push press, seated press, press up (as they say in Britain), incline press, horizontal/ flat press, decline press etc etc etc
As far as the article goes the first point about muscle activation I didn't pay much attention to however his point about shoulder mobility, impingement etc is scientifically correct, particularly if the hands are pronated (a reason I will likely never do straight bar overhead work again). Joe DeFranco is anti overhead pressing for most athletes unless they have sufficient shoulder and thoracic mobility. Few other S&C guys around that have the same school of thought too
I'm on the fence a bit because I haven't personally seen enough cases to make a judgement but I'm leaning towards 'people with internally rotated (or hunched) shoulders should avoid overhead pressing, particularly with a pronated grip until their posture is improved'
This does raise the argument of whether or not pull ups will cause the same shoulder problems (again, my experiences with a wider grip especially, seem to suggest that shoulder immobility makes all overhead pushing and pulling potentially a dangerous activity)
Goosey
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Correct
Goosey
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If you place your arms directly in front of your body and then lift you will at some point feel a resistance in the shoulder, you will notice the same when the arms are at the side.
Somewhere in between is the best place.
This relates both to pulling and pushing and the structure of the shoulder joint.
Some get away with it, most don't.
You will notice a lot of pressing is done with a log and mostly with older trainers look at the arm and hand placement
The Hamburgler
Spotter Loader
Technique won't compensate for a lack of mobility
You think no one has damaged their back deadlifting with great technique? There is a risk with all exercises it is just lessened when good techniques is used.
dandexter
New member
Didn't bother reading the whole thing, no point. I love military press, is my all time favourite lift and i'm not going to stop it because some guy jumps on the internet having a cry about it.
I'v been doing it 2 times a week (sometimes more) for the last 2.25 years, without any problems. Feels great.
Some people seem to get torn up from overhead presses, then cry about it. Same thing happens countless times on bench press with shoulders, I know more people who've hurt themselfs on bench then military press.
Same as squats, countless injuries, same as deadlifts.
There is a difference as far as I have been told...
Quick Run Down
Standing Overhead/Shoulder Press: Unrack the weight, stand with the weight, press it over head locking the elbows out, without any leg drive.
Seated Overhead/Shoulder Press: Same as above, just instead of standing you do it seated.
Push Press: Similar to Standing Overhead Press/Shoulder Press, however use leg drive to help press the weight. Idea is overload/work the out strength/triceps.
Military Press - This is the strictest and hardest of the overhead movements, very similar to overhead/shoulder press, however you HAVE to use a closer foot stance, heels touching. No wide stance, or staggered foot stance like you can use in the overhead/shoulder press. This makes it harder on your core and is the correct way to military press.
Seated Military Press - No such thing, military press means standing NOT seated.
Clean & Press - Old school Olympic lift, means clean the weight up from the ground, then press it overhead without any leg drive.
Standing Behind Neck Press - Start with the barbell behind your neck, press it up until elbows locked.
Seated Behind Neck Press- Same as above, just seated. These are the ones that aren't safe for your shoulders.
Then you have jerks etc, but they aren't anything like a press.
Only small differences, hence all the difference names. That is a basic run down from what information I have read over the years.
I'v been doing it 2 times a week (sometimes more) for the last 2.25 years, without any problems. Feels great.
Some people seem to get torn up from overhead presses, then cry about it. Same thing happens countless times on bench press with shoulders, I know more people who've hurt themselfs on bench then military press.
Same as squats, countless injuries, same as deadlifts.
There is a difference as far as I have been told...
Quick Run Down
Standing Overhead/Shoulder Press: Unrack the weight, stand with the weight, press it over head locking the elbows out, without any leg drive.
Seated Overhead/Shoulder Press: Same as above, just instead of standing you do it seated.
Push Press: Similar to Standing Overhead Press/Shoulder Press, however use leg drive to help press the weight. Idea is overload/work the out strength/triceps.
Military Press - This is the strictest and hardest of the overhead movements, very similar to overhead/shoulder press, however you HAVE to use a closer foot stance, heels touching. No wide stance, or staggered foot stance like you can use in the overhead/shoulder press. This makes it harder on your core and is the correct way to military press.
Seated Military Press - No such thing, military press means standing NOT seated.
Clean & Press - Old school Olympic lift, means clean the weight up from the ground, then press it overhead without any leg drive.
Standing Behind Neck Press - Start with the barbell behind your neck, press it up until elbows locked.
Seated Behind Neck Press- Same as above, just seated. These are the ones that aren't safe for your shoulders.
Then you have jerks etc, but they aren't anything like a press.
Only small differences, hence all the difference names. That is a basic run down from what information I have read over the years.
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0ni
Registered Rustler
Why?
I don't count any lift unless it's locked out.
dandexter
New member
I'd like to hear why?
KungFooGoo
Gangster
Isn't that an old school BB thing to not lock certain lifts out?
0ni
Registered Rustler
Yes, it keeps the tension on the target muscles, but I feel that is not what he was on about... "especially on overhead presses" implies that he is on about some sort of safety reason
Darkoz
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I'm talking about targeting the muscle being worked, time under tension and reducing the stress on the joints, it may be a requirement in certain sports which is fair enough but I don't think there is any benefit in bodybuilding by locking out.
Rambodian
No I'm not cambodian
Its an interesting article, and I can see why SOHPs may be bothersome to some, but I must say that I have never ever had any sort of joint pain when doing them. The only pain I get is doms in my abs/obliques and front/side delts/upper traps. I also don't do them for the best developer of deltoids muscle, I do them as a whole body way of working the delts, in other words I do them standing so I have to maintain tension all over my body whilst working my shoulders. It makes for a great full body compound movement that targets the delts with a better bang for your buck than any other full body way of targeting the delts. If I was doing an isolation exercise to target the side OR front OR rear delts, than I would do lateral raises. But I don't put them in the same bag of exercises as far as I am concerned.
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