rebuilding squat/deadlift form

[siiiski]

Hey guys,

so i decided the best way to avoid a more serious injury in the future is to rebuild my major lifts, i was doing them at a decent weight, but after hurting my lower back a couple weeks ago, i decided it would be a good idea to learn and get proper form down as i had to teach myself (workout at home).

Just wondering if there's any good tips or ques for learning the squat and deadlift with good form. I see a lot of coaches use a stick across peoples backs for deadlifting? to make sure eveythings straight so to speak, but obviously i cant do that by myself. I also see people starting people off with wall squats, and the goblet squats? Is this a good idea?

I do realise what a lot of people will say that

1) its got a lot do with flexibility. I am working on this and have been for the last month, slowly getting there

2) it's hard to tell without a form video. but with my back at the moment i cant take a video

Just wondering what you coaches do to teach the squat and deadlift for the vast majority of newbies. I have been at a stage where i was deadlifting and squatting fairly heavy, but i was never that confident with form and i figure it's best to drop my ego and get it right now then pay for it later. Or even better does anyone know any coaches in canberra which i can see after my back gets better?

cheers guys.

 

[0ni]

videos are needed

 

[Shrek]

Yeah post some vids for critique.

 

[siiiski]

figured as much , ill post some vids when i get my squats up and running again hopefully within a couple weeks. Cheers guys.

 

[Chisholm]

Do olympic style squats to FULL depth. Not only will you have great mobility, but learn to move with an upright/straight torso which is much easier on your lower back. Get a pair of oly lifting shoes.

This was my experience after an L4/L5 herniation. My poundages suck though, if you want to move bigger weights do low-bar half squats.

 

[siiiski]

Thanks mate, been doing front squats since my backs been getting better really helps keep me upright and take pressure of the problem area, cheers.

Sent from my HTC_PN071 using Tapatalk 2

 

[jzpowahz]

Do olympic style squats to FULL depth. Not only will you have great mobility, but learn to move with an upright/straight torso which is much easier on your lower back. Get a pair of oly lifting shoes.

This was my experience after an L4/L5 herniation. My poundages suck though, if you want to move bigger weights do low-bar half squats.

First I've heard of this? If the lumbar spine is neutral at the bottom of either squat, I wouldn't have thought there would be much difference in recruitment of lower back muscles. The levers are a bit more in favour of the high bar squat I'd say though (closer to centre of bar). And I suppose the lighter weight of a high bar squat will also mean less total loading.

 

[Bazza20]

First I've heard of this? If the lumbar spine is neutral at the bottom of either squat, I wouldn't have thought there would be much difference in recruitment of lower back muscles. The levers are a bit more in favour of the high bar squat I'd say though (closer to centre of bar). And I suppose the lighter weight of a high bar squat will also mean less total loading.

The theory is higher shear forces with low bar squat due to the greater forward lean.

 

[Brick]

Do olympic style squats to FULL depth. Not only will you have great mobility, but learn to move with an upright/straight torso which is much easier on your lower back. Get a pair of oly lifting shoes.

This was my experience after an L4/L5 herniation. My poundages suck though, if you want to move bigger weights do low-bar half squats.

This only applies if your been a dickhead and moving more weight then you can handle and turning your low bars into a bastardised good morning. Seen plenty of people do exactly the same when hi bar squatting.

 

[Zoot]

This only applies if your been a dickhead and moving more weight then you can handle and turning your low bars into a bastardised good morning. Seen plenty of people do exactly the same when hi bar squatting.

Bazza has a point though - with all other things being equal, the high-bar squat moves the center of gravity forward a little, so you can afford to (or have to) sit the torso upright a little more to bring it back over the heels. Hence less potential to turn a high-bar squat into a good-morning => less shear forces

 

[The Hamburgler]

I will hunt around for the article, but basically iirc a study showed there was less shearing forces on the back in low bar squats than front and high bar squats.

plus this is the PLing section; why would you advocate someone to squat high bar?

 

[Goosey]

Shearing force of what exactly?

If the squat is done correctly, then using high, low, medium, front, over-head or whatever there will not be any "shearing force".

 

[Zoot]

Perhaps bending moment is a better term.

You're saying that in all of these squat variants, there is no involvement of the spinal erectors or the core muscles, that the load is purely compressive and acts vertically down the spine?

 

[Goosey]

Perhaps bending moment is a better term.

You're saying that in all of these squat variants, there is no involvement of the spinal erectors or the core muscles, that the load is purely compressive and acts vertically down the spine?

No, Every muscle under the bar is working mechanically and supportive.

If the spine maintains its natural curvature throughout the movement, then there can be no "shearing force" of the spine.

The main issue with squatting and the most important in relation to spine integrity is ones ability to squat deep without any posterior pelvic tilt.

A classic example of short torso and long thigh and legs, will need to lean forward more, placing the bar lower on the back will make matters worse.

Shearing force is best described when a trainee while using a leg-press, places his legs too low on the plate.
Where the line of force is pulling the joints apart rather pushing together.
Joints being pulled apart, places the emphasis on tendons and ligament trying to keep the joints together, and little emphasis on the actual muscles performing the mechinal work, decreasing any chance of improved flexibility, which is one of the many elements/byproducts of strength.

 

[Bazza20]

No. Shearing force is less with a neutral spine but it is not zero.