Why I dont deload my lifters

[dave]

Oh sorry I thought you said his training partners didn't train saturday? I must have misread it.

You obviously said Max didn't train saturday because his training partners arrived later than usual, this upset Max's delicate disposition and his plans for the remainder of the afternoon. Leaving him with no choice but to tell nick fanciful stories about taking time off training and a variety of bodily ailments.

Little bugger!

hehehe that was good.

 

[Kyle Aaron]

Perhaps Max wants to take a few weeks off, but Coach Papa is not going to let him

I like the idea expressed by some of the old strongmen of having a planned week off every 6 or 12 or whatever weeks, and coming back stronger. Dan John expresses this ideas a "the rule of five" - in every five workouts, one will be a disaster, and one will be awesome, so plan for it with time off.

But I also like the idea of, if you stall in one lift, try a similar lift for a while then come back to it. I have done that a little bit with my clients, haven't had enough for long enough to really test it out, though, most are happily powering along in newbie linear progression. When I've done it, I've had them switch from back to front squat, OHP to bench, that sort of thing.

I stole this idea from Markos when I visited him, I mentioned that the S&C coach of the Aussie cycle sprint team had said that if people get a PB or if they do worse than normal, he stops the workout, cools them down and sends them home. If I recall correctly, Markos said that since they're paying by the session he can't send them home, but he will have them do something different to normal for a break - but a productive break.

 

[haz]

changing a lift is still a deload. the effort can still be high but it wont be as taxing on the CNS, most likely.

however it think that when you come back to the inital lift it will take 2-3 weeks to get back, or maybe more. which means that you do sorta deload anyways.

i like resetting. becuase your still grooving the motion, (the best way to imporve a squat is to squat), and it will give a bit of a break to the mind and body.

my opinions

 

[PTC]

No way known is changing a lift a deload. A deload is a reduced effort, we dont do that. You might, but thats not what I do, quite the opposite really, effort is always high, even if were doing Thrusters.

You guys are confused, except for you Kyle.

From a pure business sense, I should make everyone deload, keep them training, take there money.

Thats not my style. If you need a break, take a break, dont waste your money with pussy efforts.

Nick, did Max also tell you he was having 2-3 weeks off? He took 1/2 week off.

He's the child and client, I'm the adult and trainer.

He wanted to play Twilight (soccer), pure and simple.

 

[PTC]

changing a lift is still a deload. the effort can still be high but it wont be as taxing on the CNS, most likely.

however it think that when you come back to the inital lift it will take 2-3 weeks to get back, or maybe more. which means that you do sorta deload anyways.

i like resetting. becuase your still grooving the motion, (the best way to imporve a squat is to squat), and it will give a bit of a break to the mind and body.

my opinions

Try squatting 60kg x 10 for the next 2 years, tell me how much your squat improves.

You might take 2-3 weeks to get back in the groove, but I gave an example of Ryan adding 25kg FIRST SESSION BACK SQUATTING.

Maybe because the effort stayed high on trap bar deadlifts and he wasnt softcockingit

 

[Dancelot]

Try squatting 60kg x 10 for the next 2 years, tell me how much your squat improves.

That's what guys at a typical gym do when their lifting stalls and they have no idea how to progress. They call it "maintaining". I hate that word!

 

[Oli]

But I also like the idea of, if you stall in one lift, try a similar lift for a while then come back to it. I have done that a little bit with my clients, haven't had enough for long enough to really test it out, though, most are happily powering along in newbie linear progression. When I've done it, I've had them switch from back to front squat, OHP to bench, that sort of thing.

I don't. If you're a guitarist struggling with speed you dont play cello until its resolved.

The Romans had the right idea with the negative connotations they attached to mutatio. Never change.

 

[haz]

Try squatting 60kg x 10 for the next 2 years, tell me how much your squat improves.

You might take 2-3 weeks to get back in the groove, but I gave an example of Ryan adding 25kg FIRST SESSION BACK SQUATTING.

Maybe because the effort stayed high on trap bar deadlifts and he wasnt softcockingit

hahaha. 60x10 for two years is exactly what I mean.

Perhaps it was the break from squats that produced the improvement and not the addition of the trap bar. maybe before the trap bar he was overreached on squats and therefor fatigue was masking performance. deload sucessful.

 

[PTC]

I think the definition of deload needs to be addressed here.

I call it softcockinit.

It means to train with a REDUCED workload for a period, before systematically climbing back up to where you were.

Please explain how Ryan hitting PB's in Trap bar deads was softcockinit?

 

[Oli]

Please explain how Ryan hitting PB's in Trap bar deads was softcockinit?

Because the 300ish you spent on a trap bar could have got you two iron maiden tickets.

 

[PowerBuilder]

I've somewhat experienced this. I recently pretty much only back squatted, with a linear approach to hit a new. 5RM. I hit 110kg for 5. That's a pb. When I came back to do snatches, suddenly 45kg felt a lot lighter.
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[Paullie]

pb, how long have you been oly lifting for?

 

[bongobongo]

if you don't deload how do you peak for competition??

 

[dave]

Tapering and deloading are different things.

 

[bongobongo]

Tapering and deloading are different things.

How are they different? Mightn't a deload be a taper and vice versa?

 

[dave]

Tapering is dropping your volume but not your intensity to peak for a comp. So you may lift at 50-60% of your normal volume but you will still be near maxing out. It is specific to a comp and only used before that.

Deloading is used as a recovery tool to allow you to be refreshed through out your training cycle (Markos likes full rest some other people like an active rest so they deload).

 

[bongobongo]

Tapering is dropping your volume but not your intensity to peak for a comp. So you may lift at 50-60% of your normal volume but you will still be near maxing out. It is specific to a comp and only used before that.

Deloading is used as a recovery tool to allow you to be refreshed through out your training cycle (Markos likes full rest some other people like an active rest so they deload).

But many of the Russian powerlifting programs I have seen reduce both volume and intensity in the final 2 weeks of the competition phase.
I recall seeing similar advice on elitefts from Scott Yard and others saying you do the highest intensity sessions 2 or 3 weeks out then deload, by reducing volume and intensity so you are strong and fresh for comp. I think they call it supercompensation.

 

[PowerBuilder]

(I think) tapering has a lot to do with a concept called delayed transformation, the theory is that if you were to do 10 push ups now, the effect of those push ups won't happen for a while. Not long due to it probably not being much effort.
The effect of 4 weeks of prep for a competition won't be evident till a while due to it being quite demanding. So, I guess delayed transformation is like depart reaction to your muscles and central nervous system.
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[dave]

But many of the Russian powerlifting programs I have seen reduce both volume and intensity in the final 2 weeks of the competition phase.
I recall seeing similar advice on elitefts from Scott Yard and others saying you do the highest intensity sessions 2 or 3 weeks out then deload, by reducing volume and intensity so you are strong and fresh for comp. I think they call it supercompensation.

Even if they choose to do it this way it is still for a comp and not just part of the usual training cycle. It is used to peak for a comp where is a deload is just basically for recovery from accumulated fatigue. Similar methods but different concept and application.

And in response to their methods it has been shown that keeping the intensity up provides a better ability to perform at the competition than dropping intensity. But they can do what they want, it is obviously still working well.

 

[Oli]

Isnt rotating exercises pretty much a deload by another name anyway? if my squat stalls so I go do safety bar squats for a bit isnt the lighter load of a more balance dependant safety squat simply going to give my body time to rest up?