Muhammad Ali Knocked Trump’s Muslim Ban Before He Died

[Darkoz]

not if there was a vote in it; he would say i love Christians.

I think he's already said that
He also loves Mexicans and the chinese

 

[Fadi]

getting back to topic, i reckon ali's choice to be a muslim was as much political as anything else.

Yes in the 60s for sure (as was the case with Malcolm X), but not so in 1975 when he decided to join the fold of Sunni Islam (mainstream Islam). Nation of Islam is not a Muslim religion, but like you said, was a knee jerk reaction of a self proclaimed prophet Elijah Muhammad, who was here to save the blacks from those "racist" American whites etc...

 

[Fadi]

Fadi, I am not a Christian as I have said repeatedly..

Sorry mate, my fault for thinking you were. However, since you speak so highly of the New Testament (and you know it well), I'm curious as to why you're not one by now?

 

[spartacus]

stiffy is a verbal boxing promoter. He is to change his avatar to Don King. As Darko points out, he sits on fence and provokes, unlike Trump who deliberately picks his enemies.

Stiffy is probably one who needs God; so yes, he may need to re-read the New Testament (albeit a very boring book).

 

[Stiffy]

Sorry mate, my fault for thinking you were. However, since you speak so highly of the New Testament (and you know it well), I'm curious as to why you're not one by now?

My Mother died very young Fadi, with very few personal possessions, I think all she had when she died were a few $1 dresses, a few presents her children gave her and her 'Living Bible'. She sacrificed her entire life for others and died very young. I saw that example (and the example of others) as a kid and followed it. But I soon realised that there are a lot of bad people out there who use and abuse good people. I selfishly I guess, choose not to lead that life of a (Christian) martyr. (EDIT: I use Martyr in the sense of sacrificing yourself/life for others.)

I learnt Christianity as a kid, then came back to at one stage in my life, but 'reality' forced me back to Atheism.

 

[Fadi]

My Mother died very young Fadi, with very few personal possessions, I think all she had when she died were a few $1 dresses, a few presents her children gave her and her 'Living Bible'. She sacrificed her entire life for others and died very young. I saw that example (and the example of others) as a kid and followed it. But I soon realised that there are a lot of bad people out there who use and abuse good people. I selfishly I guess, choose not to lead that life of a (Christian) martyr.

I learnt Christianity as a kid, then came back to at one stage in my life, but 'reality' forced me back to Atheism.

Fair enough and thank you for sharing the above with me brother, I fully respect your decision and your points of view.

By the way so everyone reading this knows, I've never (and I wouldn't) claim a monopoly of wisdom and truth to Islam, as truth and wisdom is a trait I fully honour and respect irrespective of its original source. So brother Darkoz if you're reading these words, please know that I don't look at you differently (in a lesser or negative sense) than another fellow human being. I am not a judgmental person, not something I can say about so many Muslims, Christians, Atheists, and so on and so forth. In the same token (if you're reading this Spart), I don't on one hand encourage the freedom of choice to believe in whatever, then go on to insult that belief if it doesn't resonate with what I (or my logic and reason) dictates to be a more rational approach.

 

[spartacus]

no problem, I reiterate my belief that I can't understand why any one believes in God. anything else from me, would be just bullshit.

If people need religion, good luck to them. I am not seeking to judge anyone.

I personally find absolutely nothing rationale about such faith, only that it is a personal choice to embrace the metaphysical.

my comments are consistent with my faith in liberalism, open debate in secular societies helps diminish the influence (need) of religion. This is what I believe in; it is what I feel is necessary to develop the capacity to promote a better world; it is my own kind of faith from decades of personal thinking.

 

[Darkoz]

......So brother Darkoz if you're reading these words, please know that I don't look at you differently (in a lesser or negative sense) than another fellow human being. I am not a judgmental person, not something I can say about so many Muslims, Christians, Atheists, and so on and so forth.

That goes without saying Fadi, I thought it was just healthy discourse on our different views and not a criticism of individuals.
No judgement from me mate.

 

[spartacus]

the thing with ali is he showed us the power of dissent, which had nothing to do with his religion and made us think. For instance, he took a very principled stand against the Vietnam war, although then he was penalised for it.

He also made some very stupid comments, say on inter-racial marriage.

 

[spartacus]

I see Trump is now criticising judge of his case because he is supposedly Mexican. Actually the judge was born in USA.

 

[bull]

There has been some discussion here about how religion keeps worming its way into politics. You need to understand that religion is a political system. It was designed and perfected over many centuries as a way for people to relate to each other. Each time it failed, the guys at the top tweaked it and went again. It eventually became such an effective method of controlling a society that Christianity and Islam grew out of it and used the same system to support slightly different beliefs.

Religion has no choice but to be political. It is pure politics.

For those who struggle to understand the rituals and the imaginary friends aspects of religion, all I can say is that has been proven to work over thousands of years.

Sent from my R7sf using Tapatalk

 

[Fadi]

There has been some discussion here about how religion keeps worming its way into politics. You need to understand that religion is a political system. It was designed and perfected over many centuries as a way for people to relate to each other. Each time it failed, the guys at the top tweaked it and went again. It eventually became such an effective method of controlling a society that Christianity and Islam grew out of it and used the same system to support slightly different beliefs.

Religion has no choice but to be political. It is pure politics.

For those who struggle to understand the rituals and the imaginary friends aspects of religion, all I can say is that has been proven to work over thousands of years.

Sent from my R7sf using Tapatalk

Interesting theory and one I haven't heard of before. Thank you.

 

[Johnnie Walker]

this must be like the 100th circle jerk about religion on this forum. maybe if no one talked about it and kept things to them selves we wouldnt have any problems?

ive always been a believe that people have the right to do what ever the fuck they feel like behind closed doors, but not in public.

 

[Darkoz]

Well I think it's healthy to talk about and acknowledge our differences rather than act like they don't exist which is what the leftist SJW want.

 

[Fadi]

this must be like the 100th circle jerk about religion on this forum. maybe if no one talked about it and kept things to them selves we wouldnt have any problems?

I haven't seen any problems, on the contrary, most members who've participated did so with mutual respect. As far as "if no one talked about it", no one is forced to talk about it, or about any other subject matter for that matter.

I put to you that if someone's intention is to argue whilst resorting to ridicule, insults and mocking; they would do so irrespective if the subject matter was pertaining to religion, politics, women' rights, or whatever else.

Have you noticed I said women' rights and not men' rights? Now that's a subject matter I wouldn't mind discussing, as I find this country (Australia) treats men as guilty before proven innocent. My country of origin (Lebanon) does the exact opposite, in treating women guilty before proven innocent. Both countries in my opinion have grossly leaned or taken a one sided approach to how the law views the different sexes. I argue for and support an approach that would look at a case by case basis, for example if a woman calls the police and cries: HE ABUSED ME!!!..., the police here have been programmed to 100% believe what this woman is saying (especially if tears happen to be rolling down her face) which would (automatically) according to most make what she says more believable.

By the way, I have 5 girls, so this is not some bash against women but rather it's what I see and hear (and have been seeing and hearing for the past 39 years). I think (I'm not 100% sure), but hasn't there been some sort of "men support clubs" of sort springing up in this country simply because men feel left out by a system that leans more favourably towards women' rights?

 

[bull]

Interesting theory and one I haven't heard of before. Thank you.

Fadi, If you take away the higher power aspect of the major religions, they all become good, safe, respectful ways to live in a group. The stability afforded by those rules has changed the world.

I will never know but I suspect that the 'higher power' was added as the big stick when a highly superstitious populace was failing to follow the rules.

Sent from my R7sf using Tapatalk

 

[Fadi]

Fadi, If you take away the higher power aspect of the major religions, they all become good, safe, respectful ways to live in a group. The stability afforded by those rules has changed the world.

I will never know but I suspect that the 'higher power' was added as the big stick when a highly superstitious populace was failing to follow the rules.

Sent from my R7sf using Tapatalk

Again, thank you for your input sir. As for the higher power (I think you mean God yeh?) and that stick, I can assure you it very much exists in Islam. However, if you ever read the Qur'an, you'd find there are more "carrots" than "sticks" to get your attention etc. I speak for myself (and not other Muslims) when I tell you that the "stick" has always turned me away, as I preferred the "carrot", and the appealing to one's intellectual faculties and reasoning powers. Yet, others only listen when a "stick" appears, as it seems to work for certain group of people, hence the Qur'an addresses both of these human traits or mentalities.

 

[Darkoz]

I haven't seen any problems, on the contrary, most members who've participated did so with mutual respect. As far as "if no one talked about it", no one is forced to talk about it, or about any other subject matter for that matter.

I put to you that if someone's intention is to argue whilst resorting to ridicule, insults and mocking; they would do so irrespective if the subject matter was pertaining to religion, politics, women' rights, or whatever else.

Have you noticed I said women' rights and not men' rights? Now that's a subject matter I wouldn't mind discussing, as I find this country (Australia) treats men as guilty before proven innocent. My country of origin (Lebanon) does the exact opposite, in treating women guilty before proven innocent. Both countries in my opinion have grossly leaned or taken a one sided approach to how the law views the different sexes. I argue for and support an approach that would look at a case by case basis, for example if a woman calls the police and cries: HE ABUSED ME!!!..., the police here have been programmed to 100% believe what this woman is saying (especially if tears happen to be rolling down her face) which would (automatically) according to most make what she says more believable.

By the way, I have 5 girls, so this is not some bash against women but rather it's what I see and hear (and have been seeing and hearing for the past 39 years). I think (I'm not 100% sure), but hasn't there been some sort of "men support clubs" of sort springing up in this country simply because men feel left out by a system that leans more favourably towards women' rights?

When you have time time watch this conversation Fadi
All I can say is bitches be crazy, no disrespect to any precious snow flakes out there ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFFJWzgUmTE

 

[Fadi]

When you have time time watch this conversation Fadi
All I can say is bitches be crazy, no disrespect to any precious snow flakes out there ��

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFFJWzgUmTE

I managed to watch about 15 minutes straight Darkoz, and then I had to stop. I didn't stop because I was bored, but rather because the woman feminist was clearly blinded by her biases towards men. When she was confronted with, and I'm rephrasing a bit here, "if you get fucked up the ass, you don't go on texting your rapist asking him for more anal sex now would you?"....To which her response (or rather flimsy and dangerous defense in my opinion) was, "we all deal with trauma in a different way. Also she (the "victim") was young." I like when he tells her that people like her infuriate him because what she's doing to this girl now is empowering her to either do more wrong, or to do wrong and feel she's in the right. Why?!!!!! Because she's a woman, and woman (according to this moron feminist) are right by default.

That was exactly my point Darkoz, that in Australia (just like in Lebanon) but in reverse gender wise, empowerment of the woman is to such an extent that they feel they can provoke the hell out of a man, drive him mental etc., by (for example) holding his emotions hostage towards their shared children, that they feel it's within their right to do so, because they've got their back covered!

I think women who use the children as an emotional weapon against their father, so as to rub his nose into the dirt, ought to face the full force of the law against participating in such a sub-human act! But then again I reflect and ponder, what kind of law are we talking about; the same law that encourages and empower the woman to feel an air of superiority towards her ex-husband? There's no equality or fairness here, or men would not feel wrongly done by as they do now.

 

[Darkoz]

I managed to watch about 15 minutes straight Darkoz, and then I had to stop. I didn't stop because I was bored, but rather because the woman feminist was clearly blinded by her biases towards men. When she was confronted with, and I'm rephrasing a bit here, "if you get fucked up the ass, you don't go on texting your rapist asking him for more anal sex now would you?"....To which her response (or rather flimsy and dangerous defense in my opinion) was, "we all deal with trauma in a different way. Also she (the "victim") was young." I like when he tells her that people like her infuriate him because what she's doing to this girl now is empowering her to either do more wrong, or to do wrong and feel she's in the right. Why?!!!!! Because she's a woman, and woman (according to this moron feminist) are right by default.

That was exactly my point Darkoz, that in Australia (just like in Lebanon) but in reverse gender wise, empowerment of the woman is to such an extent that they feel they can provoke the hell out of a man, drive him mental etc., by (for example) holding his emotions hostage towards their shared children, that they feel it's within their right to do so, because they've got their back covered!

I think women who use the children as an emotional weapon against their father, so as to rub his nose into the dirt, ought to face the full force of the law against participating in such a sub-human act! But then again I reflect and ponder, what kind of law are we talking about; the same law that encourages and empower the woman to feel an air of superiority towards her ex-husband? There's no equality or fairness here, or men would not feel wrongly done by as they do now.

Yes, I had the urge to give her an uppercut ?